Digital GardenMP.404

Me: This mic — OK hold on… there we go.
So, you listened to the whole album? How many times did you listen? Did you take it in chunks? Did you go back to certain songs over and over again, or did you sit and listen to the whole thing?

Ryan: I sat down and listened to the first six songs, and then I had to go and do work and stuff. This morning I listened to the rest of it while doing my morning routine — which is honestly how I listen to music now, while I’m doing other things.I also listened in a few different places. I listened in my headphones, I listened in the studio here. It was cool — it was fun to listen to it like a normal person would.

How would you describe the sound or mix of genres you hear in it? What “sound world” did it bring you to?

Ryan: Man, it goes all over the place, doesn’t it? They did a great job. I’d still call it overall a pop album, but they really branch into different sects of that. The through-line is her voice — it’s always front and center. That’s what keeps it together even though it goes in so many different directions. It felt like storytelling in a pop way.

Me: I agree. My brother, Collin, described it like an opera — even a rock opera, because we grew up listening to artists like Gavin Castleton, who made fully realized story albums. Would you say this is one?

Ryan: Oh I love that, A pop opera, but yeah.

Me: I liked how it went from pop into Charli XCX-like elements or even WLF2M. I was surprised Jack didn’t resonate with it, because parts of the beats reminded me of things he might do.

WLF2MAN – a musical project created by Jack Costanza, creator of band Co-Stanza. Ryan Adams is a producer for both projects.

Ryan: Totally. But then you get songs like “Just Enough,” which are more ballad-y, more cinematic. I totally see the comparisons — it gets kind of weird with it in a fun way.

Me: I felt like the storyline becomes more complex the more you listen. She’ll slip in a subtle detail that expands the next song, but ultimately it’s the same story — she’s getting cheated on. Still, each song has a catchy, viral moment that could stand alone.

Ryan: It feels chronological. It feels like the thought process of someone who’s going through that experience. Overthinking, replaying it in her head a hundred times, having little spurts of clarity and trying to keep living.

You: It definitely feels like the stages of grief — but told after everything is already over.

Me: Did you hear she made it in seven days? Just showed up and let it all out?

Ryan: Looking at the credits, it’s mostly the same people on every track. I wouldn’t be surprised if she wrote it in a week. I would be surprised if the entire production was done in a week. Fourteen songs? Impossible. But the bones? Sure.

Me: Jack said it reminded him of when you can just pop into the program, Splice,and grab some well done free beats. Did you get that impression?

Ryan: Not really. The production felt intentional. And I recognized a couple of the names of people who worked on it — they’re very thorough. There could be some Splice stuff, but not just dragging in loops and calling it a day. More like a starting point.

Farewell Co-Stanza show (2025)

As a result of lead singer of Costanza deciding to move home to Chicago, two live shows were hosted at The Coast in Fort Collins, CO, a halt for now to playing live together ; Photography by Rachel Gelmis(insta: whxsper)

Me: There’s so much backstory to the relationship. Did that context affect how you heard it? Did knowing things about Lily Allen and David Harbour change your interpretation?

Ryan: A little bit. When it’s a very high-profile relationship — two incredibly famous people — those relationships never end well. Life at that level is already insane. If the relationship is non-traditional, even more volatility can arise.

Me: Room for indiscretion.

Ryan: Exactly. Gone for weeks at a time, traveling at the drop of a hat. If you’re already in a non-traditional, open relationship, something had to go really wrong for it to end like this — album-worthy wrong.

Me: I felt the context affected the imagery for me. Like when she says “Is she famous? Somebody famous?” I kept picturing the redheaded girl from Stranger Things. And in “Pussy Palace,” the lead-in sounded like the Stranger Things theme.

Ryan: Oh yeah — same first kind of chord. Not overt, but anyone with musical sense would pick up on it.

Me: The gasp after is so fun. It builds the anxiety of opening the door yourself. Especially after you know she’s literally on the train going to his separate apartment.

Me: Then I got recommended for what I think is the actual Pussy Palace — his separate AD tour of a Brooklyn apartment. So crazy that is just living online.
Anyway, in terms of the actual lyrics: the album is so personal. How did you respond to the emotional subject matter? Did anything stand out?

Ryan: Knowing what I know about both of them, I was definitely empathetic towards these people as you would be towards a friend experiencing something like that, and working in music you also have a different layer of empathy for it because you know this is the outlet. This is the way someone has to express themselves about something that happened to them. But I was also a little conflicted because I know some history Lily Allen, she’s not perfect either you know. I feel bad for you because something really bad did happen to you but also, girl. I felt like I was listening to a friend, someone I know talk about this because I’m so familiar with the music medium. This is how my friends express their emotions, through the songs that we work on together. so it brought me to the same place as it would doing it with a friend. 

Me: I agree, I felt really compelled to reach out to women I love, the ones that are fiercely emotional, able to wear female rage on their sleeve. I wanted to reach out to my sister in law, or one of my best friends who has also been through terrible breakups ans simultaneously has the best memory, comedically doing a disservice to her psyche. But it made me think about her in relation to this album. I wanted to text her and just be like I want to hear what YOU have to say about this like she could make this album herself. It felt like Lily Allen was in our friend group. 

Ryan: Oh yeah, the feeling like we’re gonna talk about this at the bar together, we’ll get a drink about it.

Me:Expanding on what Collin said about this album being an opera. If you were to explain to someone this album being an opera, what about the story telling, the structure of it would you highlight to do so? 

Ryans Home Studio

Ryan has worked on projects with singer song writers like, Miranda Fling, Mystee, Juney, KT and many more

Me: It reminded me of musicals I love. The storyline is easy to follow. No metaphors, no analogies — she just says how she feels.

Ryan: Its realism, plain english. That’s what reinforces it being a pop record as well, its worded so simply. It’s not to say that that’s easy to do though, right? You’re dealing with complex emotions about a complex scenario. But to speak about it really simply is actually really difficult but that’s what pop music does. Intention is the biggest thing I came away with. 

Me: After I indulged in the album, Spotify recommended more of her discography. I forgot she did “5 O’Clock in the Morning.” And “The Fear.” She always tells the story plainly — it could be too obvious, but it stays fun.

Ryan: A high-concept version of Carrie Bradshaw.

Me: I can see her running around New York in her heels now.

You: If there was a parallel universe where you were married to Lily Allen, what would her album about you say? I can re-phrase: What’s the worst thing you’ve ever done?

Ryan: The song would be called “Manchild” by Sabrina Carpenter.

You: Do you have a favorite song or favorite moment?

Ryan: Off rip, I really like “Tennis,” “Let You W/in,” and “Fruity Loop.”

You: “Tennis” is so fun. The hilarity of “Who the fuck is this bitch? La la la la.” That’s how it feels to be a woman, mad at the guy you love doing something stupid, but also being mad because you love them so much. 

Ryan: You can really tell there’s a lot of female rage in that one.

Me: “Let You W/in” is so nostalgic — early 2000s, Colbie Caillat…

Ryan: Exactly. Sara Bareilles. She owned that 2006–2007 era. It was fun to hear Lily nod back to that.

Me: “Fruity Loop”, and “Let You W/in” both of those really were the final stages of grief. Processing, that she doesn’t have to hold onto this, she can just be mad. It can just be fucked up, that it was his fault but also that everyone is fucked up and trying their best, and just trying to recreate the love they saw from between their parents, the motherhood theme of the album too makes sense she returns to it at the end. 

Ryan: Acceptance isn’t rainbows and sunshine. It’s “that was fucked up, but I have to move on.”

You: Smash or pass the album? Toot or boot?

Ryan: I enjoyed it. The production was well done, the mastering was great. It’s a sad story but really entertaining. Smash.